Airport AP's - post 'em if you got 'em

Configuration and operational information about stumbled AP's

Airport AP's - post 'em if you got 'em

Postby Guest » Mon Aug 13, 2001 6:49 am

Ok -- so NetStumbler is great for sniffing out AP's - but when you're inside a building you can't get a GPS fix. So, how about we start a list of AP's found in airports across the country, and where they were located? i.e.: Concourse C, between gates 23-29.

For example, this story ( mentions an access point at the American Airlines lounge in Regan airport. Having just gone through there yesterday (with NetStumbler running the whole time), I didn't find it - but I didn't read the story until today. It's completely feasible that I passed it - next time I'll keep an eye out for that lounge.

It would be great to compile all of this info into a simple text file I could download to the Palm. Therefore, no matter what airport I was in across the country, I'd be able to find wireless access.


Postby Guest » Mon Aug 13, 2001 8:57 am

This is purely with no credible information to back myself, so I almost don't want to post it, but....

Aren't most airport wireless ap's setup using some other type of system then the standard DSSS that NetStumbler looks for and finds? Thought I had read something on the difference of how each major vendor was being implemented and airports were running something different. Can't find the article anymore to verify so if anyone knows for SURE about this please enlighten us.

John K.

Postby Guest » Fri Aug 17, 2001 6:18 am

I know for a fact atlest one chain of airport computer places use nokia's 802.11 stuff. I will not say knwo I know this, but I will say I know it for a fact.


Postby Guest » Fri Aug 17, 2001 9:12 pm

Many of the airports that I travel have both 802.11 and the early proxima wireless networks. (sorry I do not know the name of that "standard.") In many cases they are furnished by companies like MobleStar and they are there to be used by everyone.... if you pay for an account with one of these companies. Generally you can get one days access for like $9.00. If you are needing that email fix and you have a three hour planned or unplanned layover this is just cool.

They apparently do an outbound security filter, with a firewall I presume, based off of your MAC address once you have authenticated to their website. (All HTML traffic is routed there until you sign in/pay.)


Hotel Experience

Postby Guest » Sat Aug 18, 2001 5:05 am

I saw a very similiar setup at a hotel on the strip during DefCon. Someone disconnected the hotel rent-a-computer in the room and hooked up an AP. While we could go through the AP to get to the Internet as each person came online with a different computer we got that webpage and had to click on a button indicating we would agree to pony up 19.95 for 24 hours of access.

Once we did that we would get a DHCP lease.

I was curious to find out how this worked so I did a little test. I got my computer ready to go with an IP address assigned to someone else in the room (but didn't actually apply the change), turned off the computer with the lease (ungracefully as to not release the lease) and then applied the change to mine.

It worked. I got access that way. Obviously this is no way to gain free access, as you still couldn't have more than one PC up and surfing if all you paid for was one. Still, it really got me to wondering... Our MACs were different, so it must not be checking that as long as the lease is current.

Other things took my interest and I didn't get back to play with that.

Postby Guest » Wed Aug 22, 2001 4:53 pm

Ameri-suites, a block away from Defcons tropical paradise, is a main hotel chain that allows for high-speed access. All we did was hook up an AP to cat-5 and had several laptops accessing the network via DHCP for $9.95. If you look carefully to that type of network in hotels it states 'welcome back click here to continue your 24 hour session'. Just click away..

We had several laptops on-line and using the network. This hotel is one of the best places to stay for Defcon due to its proximity to the event and high-speed net access. Something that the Hard Rock does not have...

Could you not have changed your AP's MAC...

Postby Guest » Wed Sep 19, 2001 3:07 pm match the MAC of a system that had a valid IP lease? Then, you could have had many laptops on and not paid.

Tron Of Borg

Airports- San Jose

Postby Guest » Wed Nov 14, 2001 1:50 pm

Talked to someone around 11/1/2001 that used a Cisco 802.11b network in the San Jose airport. About $6 per day for unlimited access.


Postby Guest » Wed Dec 05, 2001 2:39 pm

I saw a network at LGA in the D terminal I think it was the d. It was AA and the admirals club was across the hall ... I couldn't connect to it and I have no idea were it was coming from the club or maybe the whole terminal had it. I think that it was called mobilestar or something like that. I was only there for a min before I had to get on the plane.

Postby Guest » Mon Dec 10, 2001 2:34 am

So I gather that even if WEP is not enabled, you might not be able to get a DHCP lease from an AP ?
I guess that means that they give you a fixed IP address I assume ?

Airports and hotels

Postby Guest » Mon Dec 10, 2001 4:35 am

Mobilestar has APs in most major airports/hotels/starbucks but you have to pay a fee for using the service. Well now there is a way around that. To use the service for free all you need to do is sign up for a free login.....They also have a java app that list all locations in the US. Since I work in Downtown Seattle and Starbucks is on every street corner I am always connected now.

If any one has any troubles post a message or send me an email and I will try to help.


Airports and hotels

Postby Guest » Mon Dec 10, 2001 4:55 am

The service I mentioned above is from a company called U Are Here Communications.


Postby Guest » Mon Dec 10, 2001 3:59 pm

The airports could be using the FHSS Proxim/ericson/bla bla cards. they are 802.11b cards but they are on the FHSS standard. Look out for these as they kill the DSSS radio broadcast. (big time) so this means dont try to combine the two systems in the same area.



Postby Guest » Mon Dec 10, 2001 6:36 pm

Sorry but the FHHS is not an 802.11b standard they are 802.11 and they will not interfere with 802.11b. We have done extensive testing on this. FHHS is designed to use 15channels within 16 domains and hop randomly to different channels every 20ms where 802.11b uses 11 channels. You will not see FHHS traffic with an 802.11b card. Because of the frequent hops 802.11 is limited to 2mbps. If you need further education go to ... index.html and stop confusing the newbies….

All that I have read indicates otherwise.

Postby Guest » Tue Dec 11, 2001 6:43 am

I have been researching becoming a Wireless ISP (WISP) and all that I have read in the lists indicates that FH and DS radios transmit in the 2.4GHz ISM band. Also, FH will interfer with DS. DS can interfer with FH but because FH moves around so quickly, it is not nearly as big of impact as FH is on DS.

Ways to minimize this problem is vertical/horizontal polarization and distance placed between radios.

Another significant variable though is the amount of time the radios are actually transmitting. If the radio isn't transmitting, then, of course, there won't be any problems. Now, if you want to create a jammer (to everyone else but you), buy a WMUX which, I read, transmits 100% of the time and uses both Horizonal and Vertical polorization at the same time.

I tried finding the document in the previous post but I didn't readily find one that addressed the FH vs DS interferrence issue.

Tron Of Borg


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