Jobs because of NS

09-28-2001

Anyone else getting any work because of NS?

Today, I was using NS and it got me my first NS-related customer. I picked up an AP that was across from a military reserve unit. I slowed as I crossed the front of their property and came to a stop. Backed up a little, then forward a little...lol. Not acting 'suspicious' at all! Anyway, I decided to pull over on the easement and broke out the laptop for a walk around. (I have a mini-tower in my van that I mainly use.)

Anyway, as I was waiting for the laptop to boot, the owner of the shop where the easement is came out to ask if he could help me. (The military people called and asked him to check me out...LMAO)

Well, I was honest and told him I was doing Site Surveying (LMAO) and detected a non-encrypted network signal. Asked if he had a linksys device for allowing laptops to wirelessly connect to a network. He said yes and I proceeded to show him NS.

He asked me to come in and secure his site. He's going to give me an extra Cisco 340 PCI card that he has. It is a PCI board with the antenna and cable. It'll probably work great in my van and then I wouldn't have to keep pulling out my Orinoco Gold to put in my laptop.

I haven't checked on if these cards will work w/ NS but maybe I can sell it later if it doesn't.

Thanks NS! LOL

Tron Of Borg

09-29-2001

The Cisco won't work with NS but it will work really well in other instances. For example, the site survey software in Cisco is pretty handy. I have a Cisco 350 in a BSD box that I use to pick up traffic from APs that aren't broadcasting SSIDs.

09-30-2001

I've called back old clients after I've stumbled their networks. I'm worried about legal issues when calling new companies.

10-01-2001

I've had the same problem.
I work for a network security company in a fairly small town. (actually, it's just a few people and we all own the company) Anyway, this job is a hacker's dream. I get to set test-beds for wargaming and all kinds of great things.
We've all been wardriving ALOT lately, and we're hitting way more than we should (in our opinion). But we really can't offer our services to any people with open networks. It's just unethical (and possibly illegal). It's to bad really, because there's LOTS of people here who could use our services...

10-01-2001

Forgot this:

The best one we've found is a linksys AP that's using DHCP. We can pick it up more than 3 blocks away, and browse the network and all that jazz. They also didn't change the default password on the router, so we could play with that if we felt like it.
Here's the best part: the company who runs this network is the closest thing to our "competition". We've actually lost a few customers to them because of the way alot of us look. (we're all fairly young, and I have tattoo's and 1/2 inch holes in me ears.) Oh well, their loss.
I'd just like to walk in the door and tell them about their network problems. Or hell, just send a nice form letter.

10-03-2001

Told the boss of the IT group his WLAN was in secure.
They don't care so does anyone know how to secure Compaq
WL400's ? I've got to do it & the config utility don't
appear to do it correctly !!!! Errrggghhh

Scanbler.

10-03-2001

Telling people about their problems is a double-edged sword. However, I think if one can present a professional plan and explaination things will probably go well.

This is what I'm working on.
1. Have on hand documentation on the various proceedures for each brand of AP regarding how to secure them.

2. A paper on what steps I would take to secure a network where AP's are concerned: A. MAC Access/Denial; B. Closed network (No ESSID broadcasts); C. WEP (-grin-); D. A second firewall behind the AP where ppl would have to use VPN to access the network; E. NO DHCP on the AP; F. Site survey (LOL) for internal antenna placement that allows for minimal exterior signal detection.

3. A list of customers who I've already provided related services. Even if you have to give them the AP in order to claim this. The idea is to get the list of clients for references.

4. Contact the media for exposure of the problem. This would do nothing more then create concern and drive customers to you beggin for your service. This would prevent the possible legal issue all together!

If anyone has other securing ideas, lets hear about them.

Finally, maybe we need to create an association of Stumblers. Not that it could/would have any effects on actual legal issues but it may have more of a legitimizing (sp?) effect of what we are actually doing.

Tron Of Borg

10-03-2001

Ok...first, this should raise some heads.
1. NetStumber Association = NSA LOL
2. I'm not an artist but for someone out there... my vision is this dude falling forward with his laptop flying out of one hand because he stumbled over a 'net' (fishing perhaps) on the sidewalk and the other hand is reaching for the ground. Of couse, he didn't see the net because he was looking at his laptop.

Tron Of Borg

10-05-2001

This is what I've been implementing. You put the access points in a physically separate network with a DHCP server on it, no WEP. Immediately behind the APs is a VPN device that has a policy that requires the use of IPSec to gain access to the rest of the infrastructure, otherwise, your traffic is dropped. Load up VPN clients on the wireless laptops and go. Of course, now you're subject to whatever authentication methods your VPN uses, whether it be shared secrets, rsa keys, PKI-based, token-based, passwords, etc.

10-05-2001

What VPN device do you use?

10-05-2001

I have used the Netopia R9100. It is a router w/ VPN, NAT, etc. About $400.

Tron Of Borg

10-06-2001

OpenBSD 2.9

http://www.openbsd.org

10-07-2001

So far, I've deployed this kind of solution using Check Point VPN-1, using their SecuRemote client, as well as Nokia's VPN Gateway product, with the Nokia VPN client.

10-07-2001

http://www.colubris.com

10-12-2001

I've taken a reporter from one of the pc magazines out for war driving. Something should be in print in December.

I also have a local news station planning to war drive with me on camera in a week or two.

09-28-2001	#1 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	Jobs because of NS Anyone else getting any work because of NS? Today, I was using NS and it got me my first NS-related customer. I picked up an AP that was across from a military reserve unit. I slowed as I crossed the front of their property and came to a stop. Backed up a little, then forward a little...lol. Not acting 'suspicious' at all! Anyway, I decided to pull over on the easement and broke out the laptop for a walk around. (I have a mini-tower in my van that I mainly use.) Anyway, as I was waiting for the laptop to boot, the owner of the shop where the easement is came out to ask if he could help me. (The military people called and asked him to check me out...LMAO) Well, I was honest and told him I was doing Site Surveying (LMAO) and detected a non-encrypted network signal. Asked if he had a linksys device for allowing laptops to wirelessly connect to a network. He said yes and I proceeded to show him NS. He asked me to come in and secure his site. He's going to give me an extra Cisco 340 PCI card that he has. It is a PCI board with the antenna and cable. It'll probably work great in my van and then I wouldn't have to keep pulling out my Orinoco Gold to put in my laptop. I haven't checked on if these cards will work w/ NS but maybe I can sell it later if it doesn't. Thanks NS! LOL Tron Of Borg

10-01-2001	#5 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	One more... Forgot this: The best one we've found is a linksys AP that's using DHCP. We can pick it up more than 3 blocks away, and browse the network and all that jazz. They also didn't change the default password on the router, so we could play with that if we felt like it. Here's the best part: the company who runs this network is the closest thing to our "competition". We've actually lost a few customers to them because of the way alot of us look. (we're all fairly young, and I have tattoo's and 1/2 inch holes in me ears.) Oh well, their loss. I'd just like to walk in the door and tell them about their network problems. Or hell, just send a nice form letter.

10-03-2001	#6 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	Jobs because of NS Told the boss of the IT group his WLAN was in secure. They don't care so does anyone know how to secure Compaq WL400's ? I've got to do it & the config utility don't appear to do it correctly !!!! Errrggghhh Scanbler.

10-03-2001	#7 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	Telling people of their security problems. Telling people about their problems is a double-edged sword. However, I think if one can present a professional plan and explaination things will probably go well. This is what I'm working on. 1. Have on hand documentation on the various proceedures for each brand of AP regarding how to secure them. 2. A paper on what steps I would take to secure a network where AP's are concerned: A. MAC Access/Denial; B. Closed network (No ESSID broadcasts); C. WEP (-grin-); D. A second firewall behind the AP where ppl would have to use VPN to access the network; E. NO DHCP on the AP; F. Site survey (LOL) for internal antenna placement that allows for minimal exterior signal detection. 3. A list of customers who I've already provided related services. Even if you have to give them the AP in order to claim this. The idea is to get the list of clients for references. 4. Contact the media for exposure of the problem. This would do nothing more then create concern and drive customers to you beggin for your service. This would prevent the possible legal issue all together! If anyone has other securing ideas, lets hear about them. Finally, maybe we need to create an association of Stumblers. Not that it could/would have any effects on actual legal issues but it may have more of a legitimizing (sp?) effect of what we are actually doing. Tron Of Borg

10-03-2001	#8 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	NetStumbler Association Logo Idea Ok...first, this should raise some heads. 1. NetStumber Association = NSA LOL 2. I'm not an artist but for someone out there... my vision is this dude falling forward with his laptop flying out of one hand because he stumbled over a 'net' (fishing perhaps) on the sidewalk and the other hand is reaching for the ground. Of couse, he didn't see the net because he was looking at his laptop. Tron Of Borg

09-29-2001	#2 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	The Cisco won't work with NS but it will work really well in other instances. For example, the site survey software in Cisco is pretty handy. I have a Cisco 350 in a BSD box that I use to pick up traffic from APs that aren't broadcasting SSIDs.

09-30-2001	#3 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	I've called back old clients after I've stumbled their networks. I'm worried about legal issues when calling new companies.

10-01-2001	#4 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	I've had the same problem. I work for a network security company in a fairly small town. (actually, it's just a few people and we all own the company) Anyway, this job is a hacker's dream. I get to set test-beds for wargaming and all kinds of great things. We've all been wardriving ALOT lately, and we're hitting way more than we should (in our opinion). But we really can't offer our services to any people with open networks. It's just unethical (and possibly illegal). It's to bad really, because there's LOTS of people here who could use our services...

10-05-2001	#9 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	IPSec to protect. This is what I've been implementing. You put the access points in a physically separate network with a DHCP server on it, no WEP. Immediately behind the APs is a VPN device that has a policy that requires the use of IPSec to gain access to the rest of the infrastructure, otherwise, your traffic is dropped. Load up VPN clients on the wireless laptops and go. Of course, now you're subject to whatever authentication methods your VPN uses, whether it be shared secrets, rsa keys, PKI-based, token-based, passwords, etc.

10-05-2001	#10 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	What VPN device do you use?

10-05-2001	#11 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	VPNs used I have used the Netopia R9100. It is a router w/ VPN, NAT, etc. About $400. Tron Of Borg

10-06-2001	#12 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	All you need... OpenBSD 2.9 http://www.openbsd.org

10-07-2001	#13 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	Which VPN device? So far, I've deployed this kind of solution using Check Point VPN-1, using their SecuRemote client, as well as Nokia's VPN Gateway product, with the Nokia VPN client.

10-07-2001	#14 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	http://www.colubris.com

10-12-2001	#15 (permalink)
Posts: n/a	I've taken a reporter from one of the pc magazines out for war driving. Something should be in print in December. I also have a local news station planning to war drive with me on camera in a week or two.

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