Congestion - Page 3

Thorn · 08-13-2008

Beakmyn, hell, he's in New York. He may be close, but he's still on this side of the border.

Render is the one you have to worry about. Edmonton is his town. Of course, being in Canada, he been disarmed, so you only have to worry if he gets close enough to club you with is Vagi antenna.

(ducking and running away)

brwrdrvr · 08-13-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeP928

Just get the good stuff. We brought up a network last friday using the new Enterasys (Trapeze) gear. We had set the Rogue detection mode to the aggressive range. Within 2 seconds of deploying the code from the switch controllers to the thin APs, every other AP in the building went away, including the customer's legacy network. We looked around and said "damn, that was cool. Let's do it again." So we deploy the rogue detection only and everything comes back. Push the changes back out again and boom, we own the world. It must be a similar feeling to what Streak has every time he props up on that big valve.

Quote:

Originally Posted by brwrdrvr

Sweet!! I need to set something like this in the van and drive around *evil grin*

I will implement it for a different customer tomorrow in a rolling fashion. Or maybe a circular pattern around the building. Or alternating floors, or just random. It may be a good thing I am bailing out of Canada for God's country Saturday.

I hope NorthWorst has the scotch well stocked in first class. I love the new charges from the airlines. Everything applies to the back of the bus, so it makes it easier to justify first. Hell, it figures up to about $125. per hop just to take the golf sticks along.

Canada would be a nice country if it were not for being filled up with Canadians. (OK, the obligatory shit stirring comment is out of the way, so I will crawl back in my hole before Beak staggers over to his pc.)

Mik..........BRWRDRVR

Hey wait just one minute! I would never go into Canada. Too damn cold up there for me. So you know Beak will never fall for it. Plus I think he can tell the difference between a Cajun accent and a redneck accent.

Airstreamer · 08-13-2008

The AP4000 series from Proxim has an 'auto channel' feature for both the A and B/G bands. Has Radar detection for the A band as well. Seems to work ok. Also will work with the Rogue detection software that BWR is talking about, although we don't use that. Yet.

Paxton · 08-14-2008

Summarising so far:

1. All urban areas are suffering from congestion
2. Most commercial networks are properly set up
3. Residential users are the cause of congestion
4. Residential and ISM users should work on different channels
5. Residentiall users should be using wired access
6. Most residential users don't change the channel from its default
7. Bluetooth is not suitable for SCADA
8. 802.11a is only useful up to 100 feet
9. Intelligent channel selection in routers. For: 2, Against: 1
10. More channels should be added
11. Taxing access would go down like a lead balloon
12. Canada is probably a bit cold (as a Brit that doesn't bother me much - is it wet too?)

A couple of other ideas to ease congestion:
- The beacon frame rate could be reduced
- The power limit could be reduced

Starpoint · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by brwrdrvr

SOHO wireless is just too cheap and too prevalent for many of the things that you would think about to "fix" the "congestion". I liked the idea of some type of fuzzy logic program (Just for the novelty of it)built into the residential wifi routers that would do a scan of the area and then choose an appropriate channel to operate on. It would have to then be like a wasp protecting the nest and calling that channel it's own and not change or rescan unless power were lost. The next router to be plugged in would scan the area and choose another channel. I guess the criteria would be if the router finds other routers close by they could not use a channel already being used if the signal strength is above 20-30. Not really able to set a criteria for a link quality as you would have to have routers connecting to other routers to find out that percentage. That would be quite a mess.

For the technology we have now, adding more channels to the band would be a great start.

You could always do like I did. Move away from the urban jungle and out to the sticks. Make sure your neighbors are all retired people and they don't spend the $$ on the neat little gadgets with wifi built into them. I have 2 APs near my house. Both with insignificant signals. So it's all good.

the only problem I see with auto scanning routers is that its possible you will get a swarm of them near to each other and they will stay in auto scan.

Unless they can secretly talk to each other (using BORG technology) and all decide for themselves what channel they should be on so they do not bump heads with the others.
Personally I think the setup for the router should scan and see what channels are in use at time of setup and then omit them for choices when you go to pick. I also agree we could use about another 6 channels added.

Starpoint · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paxton

Summarising so far:

1. All urban areas are suffering from congestion
2. Most commercial networks are properly set up
3. Residential users are the cause of congestion
4. Residential and ISM users should work on different channels
5. Residentiall users should be using wired access
6. Most residential users don't change the channel from its default
7. Bluetooth is not suitable for SCADA
8. 802.11a is only useful up to 100 feet
9. Intelligent channel selection in routers. For: 2, Against: 1
10. More channels should be added
11. Taxing access would go down like a lead balloon
12. Canada is probably a bit cold (as a Brit that doesn't bother me much - is it wet too?)

A couple of other ideas to ease congestion:
- The beacon frame rate could be reduced
- The power limit could be reduced

13 Texas is too damn hot

beakmyn · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paxton

Summarising so far:

1. All urban areas are suffering from congestion

Not all but most. Never make an absolute statement. I'm sure Fargo is at a decent saturation

Quote:

2. Most commercial networks are properly set up

agree

Quote:

3. Residential users are the cause of congestion

Usually, but they tend to be in close geographically areas and only affect a couple dozen people.

Quote:

4. Residential and ISM users should work on different channels

Yes, and they can't be overlapping.

Quote:

5. Residentiall users should be using wired access

No. I have wireless in my house. Of course my router is 12 foot in the air on a wall. Residential users need to be educated as to when it makes sense to use wireless over wired.

Quote:

6. Most residential users don't change the channel from its default

Correct. As well as the SSID, password, etc.

Quote:

7. Bluetooth is not suitable for SCADA

Not neccesarily. It does have a distinct purpose. If say you had a large piece of rotating equipment and didn't want to run all the I/O through a fingered roller you could install a bluetooth I/O unit on the equipment and send the I/O wirelessly to the PLC. There are other circumstances where it could be useful but you really need to plan it out beforehand.

Quote:

8. 802.11a is only useful up to 100 feet

Don't know it's not very popular here in the states.

Quote:

9. Intelligent channel selection in routers. For: 2, Against: 1

Yes. I'm seeing this more often. I believe the dd-wrt firmware supports this.

Quote:

10. More channels should be added

Quote:

11. Taxing access would go down like a lead balloon

The lead balloon analogy no longer works. We have a television show where they made a lead balloon and it floated.

Quote:

12. Canada is probably a bit cold (as a Brit that doesn't bother me much - is it wet too?)

Not any more wet then most places but they do have dental plans (ok that was my one zinger)

Quote:

A couple of other ideas to ease congestion:
- The beacon frame rate could be reduced
- The power limit could be reduced

streaker69 · 08-14-2008

Damn, it's scary, I hit it on the head that he was from England just from the statement of 'taxing' the usage.

Guess the sunspot interference is waning.

brwrdrvr · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by streaker69

Damn, it's scary, I hit it on the head that he was from England just from the statement of 'taxing' the usage.

Guess the sunspot interference is waning.

The Psychic Amish strikes again.

Paxton · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by streaker69

Damn, it's scary, I hit it on the head that he was from England just from the statement of 'taxing' the usage.

Guess the sunspot interference is waning.

We do just love taxing stuff!

streaker69 · 08-14-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paxton

We do just love taxing stuff!

Yeah, we Americans know, thus the Boston Tea Party.

08-13-2008	#31 (permalink)
Thorn Did you do the math? Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Villa Straylight Posts: 10,351	Beakmyn, hell, he's in New York. He may be close, but he's still on this side of the border. Render is the one you have to worry about. Edmonton is his town. Of course, being in Canada, he been disarmed, so you only have to worry if he gets close enough to club you with is Vagi antenna. (ducking and running away) __________________ Thorn "Read Altas Shrugged. Compare it to today. Repeat as necessary"

08-13-2008	#33 (permalink)
Airstreamer Sniffin' the aether Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: A little North of Reason Posts: 2,820	The AP4000 series from Proxim has an 'auto channel' feature for both the A and B/G bands. Has Radar detection for the A band as well. Seems to work ok. Also will work with the Rogue detection software that BWR is talking about, although we don't use that. Yet. __________________ "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards.." - Claire Wolfe, 101 Things to Do 'Til the Revolution

08-14-2008	#38 (permalink)
streaker69 Psychic Amish Stumbler Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Virginville, BlueBall, Bird In Hand, Intercourse, Paradise, PA Posts: 12,229	Damn, it's scary, I hit it on the head that he was from England just from the statement of 'taxing' the usage. Guess the sunspot interference is waning. __________________ Treat your gun like your genitals, only whip it out when it's absolutely necessary.

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08-14-2008	#34 (permalink)
Paxton Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 6	Summarising so far: 1. All urban areas are suffering from congestion 2. Most commercial networks are properly set up 3. Residential users are the cause of congestion 4. Residential and ISM users should work on different channels 5. Residentiall users should be using wired access 6. Most residential users don't change the channel from its default 7. Bluetooth is not suitable for SCADA 8. 802.11a is only useful up to 100 feet 9. Intelligent channel selection in routers. For: 2, Against: 1 10. More channels should be added 11. Taxing access would go down like a lead balloon 12. Canada is probably a bit cold (as a Brit that doesn't bother me much - is it wet too?) A couple of other ideas to ease congestion: - The beacon frame rate could be reduced - The power limit could be reduced