Cheap antenna fine if always in car?

jgoggan · 06-06-2003

Looking over at fab-corp, I see that they have the popular 5 dBi "mini mag" antenna for about $70 (I believe you can get it for $60 for mentioning this site). But, in any case, they also have the much cheaper Pacific Wireless 5.5 dB mag-mount units also for only $18.

Now, I realize that the $60 one has the integrated ground plane, but if I am always going to use the antenna while wardriving, is there any reason not to go with the much cheaper one?

Thanks!

- John...

Thorn · 06-06-2003

Look around even Fab-Corp says its far from a good antenna. Unity gain at best.

BlahBoy · 06-10-2003

Got a response from Jeff at Fab-Corp (how nice is that?

) responding to some questions about this antenna, he says that the 5-6 feet of cable on it from the manufacturer is RG-174 which is fairly high loss.

The 5 foot cable isn't quite long enough for me, and adding more cable would only make things worse, I think this is a case of you get what you pay for. If you just want to relocate your antenna to a better location it could be the answer. At the moment am weighing up the 'investment' value of their 5dB mag mount omni.

There should probably be an FAQ for the Pac Wireless 5.5dB antenna - how could you not be curious about something that seems too cheap to be true?

hawk · 06-10-2003

I got the cheap fab antenna the other day, and my custom omni toothpick (hangar wire and tin can base) with a loong pigtail (from fab) works better than the omni. The cable is certainly much lower quality than the fab's nice pigtails.. but it is super easy to mount. I kinda wish I spend the cash for the bigger omni, but it does pick up more than my orinoco does in the car (pda mounted on the dash).

Another downside with that cheap omni is it needs a metal base to work best from.

It works.. but you don't get what you don't pay for.

jkilo · 06-15-2003

I got the $18 number (MA24) from eBay. Advertised gain of 5.5dBi. Comes with a 4-foot pigtail. Included data sheet says cable loss is 0.4 dB per foot--so that's about a 1.6dB loss there.

Realistically comparing apples to apples (since even the standard Orinoco antenna will have at least dipole gain), the dipole gain value of 2.14 should also be subtracted.

5.5 - 2.14 - 1.6 = 1.8 dB

Not too much, but then again now the laptop and antenna are well-situated. That's the main advantage.

Test drive bottom line: picks up APs like fish in a barrel.

jgoggan · 06-15-2003

Indeed -- with it being that cheap -- maybe it is worth picking up if just for the better antenna positioning (roof of the car). As long as it is a positive gain in the end, that would probably be worth it to me.

I'm thinking I'm just not "into it" enough for the $60 one at this point... Maybe I'll give the $18 a shot and see how it goes. If I decide to go $60 one later, it isn't a huge loss and I can always keep the $18 as a spare or for another vehicle, I guess...

- John...

konze · 06-20-2003

Isn´t it possible to change the cable?

I found another version of this antenna for 40$, the antenna is the same, the name of the cable at this antenna is LMR 100, is that cable better?

Ciao Konze

BlahBoy · 06-21-2003

konze, where did you see the antenna with a different cable? How long?

Even if it is possible to change the cable yourself, a friend of mine who is an RF engineer says that you need to match the cable to the antenna, not sure how true that is for these antennae.

jkilo: When you say 'picks up APs like fish in a barrel', does that mean it picks them up well (easy as shooting fish in a barrel) or doesn't pick them up well (because fish are slippery)?

konze · 06-21-2003

Here is it. Is it worth the 40 bucks? When I dindt read wrong LMR 100 is the cheapest LMR cable, is it better than the RG-174 ?? Whats the difference?

Ciao Konze

BlahBoy · 06-21-2003

Well going off this simple table I found, LMR-100 is "better" than RG-174, possibly in the same way that getting kicked in the shins is "better" than being punched in the face, I don't know...

ThreePts · 01-30-2004

After purchasing my 5.5db mini omni i read up on it a bit more and got a bit disappointed with my findings. However i got it today and have already found about 20+ new APs in my area in about a 2mile drive. The signals themselve are much stronger too obviously. I have not judged accurately the improvement it has caused but overall i am happy with my $15 omni so far. Just having the antenna outside of the car is helping significantly it seems.

Update: Make that about 80 new APS in about a 3mile radius.

konze · 02-03-2004

Where did you buy your Antenna? I'm still wlanin without external Antenna in my car, but recognized a significant loss of recive strength in the presence of snow..
So I would like to get an Antenna too.

Ciao Konze

Thorn · 02-04-2004

Quote:

Originally posted by ThreePts
After purchasing my 5.5db mini omni i read up on it a bit more and got a bit disappointed with my findings. However i got it today and have already found about 20+ new APs in my area in about a 2mile drive. The signals themselve are much stronger too obviously. I have not judged accurately the improvement it has caused but overall i am happy with my $15 omni so far. Just having the antenna outside of the car is helping significantly it seems.

Update: Make that about 80 new APS in about a 3mile radius.

When all is said and done, these work about out to about unity gain. In other words, it works roughly as well as you would expect if you had the card outside the card body. So you should see some improvement over the card inside the car, but not much else.

ThreePts · 02-04-2004

Quote:

Originally posted by Thorn
When all is said and done, these work about out to about unity gain. In other words, it works roughly as well as you would expect if you had the card outside the card body. So you should see some improvement over the card inside the car, but not much else.

From my experience, If i am outside of my house with my laptop on my car I am within range of 2 networks. I have a very inconsistent signal if the laptop is on top of my car but once i hook on the 5.5 mini omni I can pull a strong consistent signal. Its possible that the enterasys antenna is not strong but none the less for $23 i am happy with my purchase. I have already doubled my found APs pretty much by going over the same places Ive driven over plenty of times in the past.

ZipperSeven · 02-05-2004

Yes and it Netstumbling a hobby or a profession for you guys?

If you just want to drive around then maybe the extra cash isn't worth it for you.

But I can tell you you will be happier with the mini-mag...its generally regarded as the best in the field for it's low price. Similar antennae can be seen for much higher.

06-06-2003	#1 (permalink)
jgoggan Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 8	Cheap antenna fine if always in car? Looking over at fab-corp, I see that they have the popular 5 dBi "mini mag" antenna for about $70 (I believe you can get it for $60 for mentioning this site). But, in any case, they also have the much cheaper Pacific Wireless 5.5 dB mag-mount units also for only $18. Now, I realize that the $60 one has the integrated ground plane, but if I am always going to use the antenna while wardriving, is there any reason not to go with the much cheaper one? Thanks! - John...

06-06-2003	#2 (permalink)
Thorn Did you do the math? Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Villa Straylight Posts: 10,360	Look around even Fab-Corp says its far from a good antenna. Unity gain at best. __________________ Thorn "Read Altas Shrugged. Compare it to today. Repeat as necessary" Last edited by Thorn : 02-04-2004 at 05:12 AM.

06-10-2003	#4 (permalink)
hawk Registered Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 16	cheap fab antenna I got the cheap fab antenna the other day, and my custom omni toothpick (hangar wire and tin can base) with a loong pigtail (from fab) works better than the omni. The cable is certainly much lower quality than the fab's nice pigtails.. but it is super easy to mount. I kinda wish I spend the cash for the bigger omni, but it does pick up more than my orinoco does in the car (pda mounted on the dash). Another downside with that cheap omni is it needs a metal base to work best from. It works.. but you don't get what you don't pay for.

01-30-2004	#11 (permalink)
ThreePts Desert Stumbler Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 136	After purchasing my 5.5db mini omni i read up on it a bit more and got a bit disappointed with my findings. However i got it today and have already found about 20+ new APs in my area in about a 2mile drive. The signals themselve are much stronger too obviously. I have not judged accurately the improvement it has caused but overall i am happy with my $15 omni so far. Just having the antenna outside of the car is helping significantly it seems. Update: Make that about 80 new APS in about a 3mile radius. Last edited by ThreePts : 01-30-2004 at 09:28 PM.

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06-10-2003	#3 (permalink)
BlahBoy Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 34	Got a response from Jeff at Fab-Corp (how nice is that? ) responding to some questions about this antenna, he says that the 5-6 feet of cable on it from the manufacturer is RG-174 which is fairly high loss. The 5 foot cable isn't quite long enough for me, and adding more cable would only make things worse, I think this is a case of you get what you pay for. If you just want to relocate your antenna to a better location it could be the answer. At the moment am weighing up the 'investment' value of their 5dB mag mount omni. There should probably be an FAQ for the Pac Wireless 5.5dB antenna - how could you not be curious about something that seems too cheap to be true?

06-15-2003	#5 (permalink)
jkilo Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 1	I got the $18 number (MA24) from eBay. Advertised gain of 5.5dBi. Comes with a 4-foot pigtail. Included data sheet says cable loss is 0.4 dB per foot--so that's about a 1.6dB loss there. Realistically comparing apples to apples (since even the standard Orinoco antenna will have at least dipole gain), the dipole gain value of 2.14 should also be subtracted. 5.5 - 2.14 - 1.6 = 1.8 dB Not too much, but then again now the laptop and antenna are well-situated. That's the main advantage. Test drive bottom line: picks up APs like fish in a barrel.

06-15-2003	#6 (permalink)
jgoggan Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 8	Indeed -- with it being that cheap -- maybe it is worth picking up if just for the better antenna positioning (roof of the car). As long as it is a positive gain in the end, that would probably be worth it to me. I'm thinking I'm just not "into it" enough for the $60 one at this point... Maybe I'll give the $18 a shot and see how it goes. If I decide to go $60 one later, it isn't a huge loss and I can always keep the $18 as a spare or for another vehicle, I guess... - John...

06-20-2003	#7 (permalink)
konze Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 12	Isn´t it possible to change the cable? I found another version of this antenna for 40$, the antenna is the same, the name of the cable at this antenna is LMR 100, is that cable better? Ciao Konze

06-21-2003	#8 (permalink)
BlahBoy Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 34	konze, where did you see the antenna with a different cable? How long? Even if it is possible to change the cable yourself, a friend of mine who is an RF engineer says that you need to match the cable to the antenna, not sure how true that is for these antennae. jkilo: When you say 'picks up APs like fish in a barrel', does that mean it picks them up well (easy as shooting fish in a barrel) or doesn't pick them up well (because fish are slippery)?

06-21-2003	#9 (permalink)
konze Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 12	Here is it. Is it worth the 40 bucks? When I dindt read wrong LMR 100 is the cheapest LMR cable, is it better than the RG-174 ?? Whats the difference? Ciao Konze

06-21-2003	#10 (permalink)
BlahBoy Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 34	Well going off this simple table I found, LMR-100 is "better" than RG-174, possibly in the same way that getting kicked in the shins is "better" than being punched in the face, I don't know...

02-03-2004	#12 (permalink)
konze Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 12	Where did you buy your Antenna? I'm still wlanin without external Antenna in my car, but recognized a significant loss of recive strength in the presence of snow.. So I would like to get an Antenna too. Ciao Konze