hackers and security

hackers and security

Postby mod that shaz » Sat Jan 17, 2004 3:25 pm

I just got my first wireless router (linksys g) and I am slowly becoming interested in all aspects of wifi including security and dealing with hackers

i am wondering, once somebody gets a ssid and a password to your router, besides being able to change router settings...how do they explore the contents of computers connected to the network?

finally, what programs will let you monitor what computers and connected to your router or using your internet connection?
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Re: hackers and security

Postby audit » Sat Jan 17, 2004 3:42 pm

Originally posted by mod that shaz
I just got my first wireless router (linksys g) and I am slowly becoming interested in all aspects of wifi including security and dealing with hackers

i am wondering, once somebody gets a ssid and a password to your router, besides being able to change router settings...how do they explore the contents of computers connected to the network?

finally, what programs will let you monitor what computers and connected to your router or using your internet connection?


Well to start off they can lock you out of your own router by changing the password.

If your systems have file sharing enabled, they should be able to browse your network very easily. Most home networks are setup under the workgroups Workgroup or Home.

In order to monitor who's connected to your system, use the logging feature of your AP and make a note of what your MAC address is of the systems are are able to connect, IE: your own systems.

Otherwise, check out this http://www.michiganwireless.org/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=getit&lid=15

Description: AirSnare is an intrusion detection system to help you monitor your wireless network.

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Re: Re: hackers and security

Postby ZipperSeven » Sat Jan 17, 2004 4:54 pm

Originally posted by audit
Well to start off they can lock you out of your own router by changing the password


Not only that but a lot of home/small business routers cannot be 'broken' in to once the password is changed. Changing the password means resetting the unit back to factory settings, which clears any logs the device might store.

I would also have to say another threat is that the logs themsevles, any logins/passwords which are sent through the URL or in the clear in the case of FTP and the like could be exploited by a router hijacker. Netgear's (and other manufacturers too) routers have the ability to email the logs, in the case of a hijack you would at least have logs up to that point, and that include any type of reconnaissance the hacker used to get in.

I would say the best measure is to add secure accounts to your secure operating systems (throw away 95/98/ME boxes) and share any files you need to just those accounts - and then remove the anyone group from those shares. By secure accounts I mean ones where the password is hard to break (not the same as the login name, more than 8-ish characters, alphanumeric, and with mixed caps and lower case and maybe even characters too.)

This is pretty much a rough outline of the way I have my home network setup, and have never had much issues. At the AP end, at least enable MAC filtering and WEP.
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Re: Re: hackers and security

Postby mod that shaz » Sat Jan 17, 2004 5:17 pm

Originally posted by audit
If your systems have file sharing enabled, they should be able to browse your network very easily. Most home networks are setup under the workgroups Workgroup or Home.


if systems are not networked (not in any workgroup) is there anyway for a hacker to view files?

also, wouldn't the hacker only be able to see files that are available to other people on the network? ex. the "shared documents" folder
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Re: Re: Re: hackers and security

Postby G8tK33per » Sat Jan 17, 2004 8:09 pm

Originally posted by mod that shaz
if systems are not networked (not in any workgroup) is there anyway for a hacker to view files?

also, wouldn't the hacker only be able to see files that are available to other people on the network? ex. the "shared documents" folder
You sure say 'hacker' quite a bit. What are you truly digging around for?
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Re: Re: Re: hackers and security

Postby Thorn » Sat Jan 17, 2004 8:30 pm

Your use of the word "hacker" in this manner is insulting. If you mean "a criminal attacking a network", then say so. Don't misuse "hacker" just because every media idiot gets it wrong.

Originally posted by mod that shaz
if systems are not networked (not in any workgroup) is there anyway for a hacker to view files?


"Not networked" and "not in any workgroup" are not the same things. Using workgroups is one subset of networking. Which is it?

If the computers are phyically connected in some standard way, (ie. using well known protocols) then there is probably a way to access some files. It depends on the network protocols, and the network topography.

Originally posted by mod that shaz
...also, wouldn't the hacker only be able to see files that are available to other people on the network? ex. the "shared documents" folder


That's one of the easiest ways, but by no means the only way.
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Postby mod that shaz » Sun Jan 18, 2004 9:08 pm

i realize all the terms of "hacker" and I hack all the time but not for any criminal reasons (ie my own computer)...sorry I meant to say "cracker" or "criminal hacker" or whatever and I know how annoying it can be when you tell people you hack and they think you are a criminal because the newspaper says "hacker steals information" and crap like that

now that that's out of the way...i have a super nub question for you:

networked computers not on a workgroup? please explain...
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Postby ZipperSeven » Sun Jan 18, 2004 9:47 pm

...from slashdot:

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Postby Thorn » Mon Jan 19, 2004 9:42 am

"Workgroups" are something that came about in the Windows world, and while is very popular for smaller LANs, it is just one model for a network. As ZipperSeven indicates a domain is another, and there are other models/protocols out there.

For example, the TCP/IP protocol has nothing to do with Workgroups even though many computers in LANs run both together. Using programs such as Telnet or FTP you can communicate over a TCP/IP-based network to other machines and access directories and files that are not "shared" in the Windows Workgroups sense of the word. Using Workgroups software these directories would never show.
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Postby G8tK33per » Mon Jan 19, 2004 9:58 am

Hmmm, I wonder if "Networking for Dummies" is still in print... :rolleyes:
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Postby Madhadder » Mon Jan 19, 2004 10:07 am

Actually, it is.... 6th Edition Even

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Re: hackers and security

Postby genexen » Mon Jan 19, 2004 10:08 am

Originally posted by mod that shaz
...i am wondering, once somebody gets a ssid and a password to your router, besides being able to change router settings...how do they explore the contents of computers connected to the network?...


In the simplest of terms, in order to explore the contents of a networked computer (without the owners permission), a few items need to be addressed.
- you will need to know the name and/or protocol address of the target machine.
- you *may* need to authenticate against the local security mechanism on the target machine.
- the target machine needs to be able to accept and process requests for remote access (smb, netbios, etc.)
- obviously you will need to have an open connection to this target machine.

I'm not going to divulge even the most basic "omg u r so 1337" networking 101 stuff here. Its safe to say that a user is at most risk of having their computer compromised are those:

-who do not perform traffic filtering at the network interface.
-who do not lock down default shares or change default passwords.
-who do not block non-essential ports.
-who do not disable non-essential services.
-who use weak, dictionary based passwords.

So if you are concerned about protecting YOUR pc from prying eyes, this should get you started.

BUT, if you are trying to get a crash course on being a reet hax0r, you will probably need to look elsewhere.
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Postby genexen » Mon Jan 19, 2004 10:09 am

Originally posted by G8tK33per
Hmmm, I wonder if "Networking for Dummies" is still in print... :rolleyes:


OMG!!! That was the first networking book I ever bought. Christ, that must have been 7-8 years ago now. How young and stupid I was back then...

(...now I'm older!!!)
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